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27 aprilie 2019

7mm wsm vs 308

So, let’s take a look at the ten rounds we have selected and see if there is any difference in ballistic coefficients between the two cartridges (Graph 3). And you still have to take into account the design of the bullet. In this cartridge comparison, we are going to examine two cartridges that behave very similar in the ballistics category. The overall length of the cartridges are the same though the base diameter is slightly, and we mean slightly, wider for the .308 Win. For those who might not be familiar with why we want to know when a bullet falls below supersonic speeds, it is because the bullet becomes more destabilized when the sound wave it left behind catches up to it. Sniper Country is reader-supported. These ranges are also going to more interesting to competition shooters or just hobbyists who like to test their skills on the range. But in this case, it’s not just because of the numbers, but there are very few options for tactical 7mm-08 rounds. From this data, no cartridge has a distinct advantage in velocity, but rather, it depends on the individual round. In the end, whatever you are confident in using is going to be a good pick. vs. .458 Lott• 7mm Rem. Velocity. For our top .308 Win range round we like the 168gr Hornady BTHP Match. If you felt you needed a bit more, a premium 175-grain 7mm or 200-grain .30 would make serious medicine, albeit at a lesser velocity. This is interesting because the 7mm-08 is using lighter weight bullets. For the .308 rounds, it has one of the best long-range trajectories where a 300-yard shot is no problem in the right hands, and 400 yards is manageable though you are getting into territory where environmental factors might influence the round with the ballistic coefficient it has. What we need to take away from this is that if you want a round with a higher BC, both of these cartridges have options in the high 0.4 to 0.5 range. I was most always hunting Deer when the Elk showed up. Mag. Is this enough difference to sway your choice to one cartridge or the other? Even when considering all three, there are still pieces to the puzzle that we are leaving out. The heavier .308 rounds do start out with more energy out of the muzzle than all of the 7mm-08 rounds we have selected and tend to maintain the lead throughout the 500-yard range, but the 7mm-08 rounds are not that far off regarding force either. 28 Nosler Brass.280 Remington Brass.280 Ackley Improved Brass Now, some hardcore guys might say that the 2/100s difference between the two makes a difference, but for most of us using factory loads, we would never know. Lastly what is the max range for each. As we have mentioned before, and are bound to mention again before the article is over, these two cartridges are very similar. Hi all - I know I'll get several opinions here, but I'm just researching ballistics and calibers for my next rifle purchase. Both are are easy to shoot, can be housed in easy-to-carry, lightweight rifles and neither cartridge requires a country mile of barrel length to get the best performance. The bullet energy is the highest of the selected .308 rounds with 1,300ft.lbs of energy at the 500-yard mark which is enough for even larger game at that range. The WSM is about the same as the long 7 mag, and they are both sharper and harder than a 30-06, but not enough to really bother you. This round has a great BC for .308 rounds (.45), and when paired with the velocity and long-range trajectory, you have an excellent round for precision shooting. It was intended to provide lighter recoil while maintaining heavy enough bullet weight and velocity to effectively reach out and kill game efficiently. These are also factory loads, and we decided to omit and hand loaded cartridges that are often loaded quite a bit hotter than factory loads. The higher the velocity, the less that certain environmental factors such as wind and gravity can affect the bullet’s trajectory. While there is not a definite and noticeable difference in the ballistic coefficients of these two cartridges, if we averaged all five rounds for each cartridge the 7mm-08 would be slightly higher (.44 vs .434). The average SD for the 7mm-08 rounds is 0.251 while the average for the .308 is 0.26. In this section, we will take a look at the actual force that is produced when firing these two cartridges in Mag. Shot placement is equally if not more important than the amount of energy that the bullet is carrying. So, let’s take a look at our ten rounds and see if we can see any differences in velocity between these two cartridges. We realize that there are a lot of other options out there and there is a good chance that a round that you like might not be here. It has a rebated rim, bottleneck casing with a 1:9.5 twist on a large rifle magnum primer. Both cartridges have near identical velocities. In 2004 I took my 99 .270 WSM and a light .375 H&H. All the way out to 500 yards, there is less than four inches of difference or less. Best Concealed Carry Insurance [Comparison Chart]. by Philip Massaro - Just a few years after the introduction of the .308, the wildcatters mated the case with 7mm bullets. All of the .308 rounds are generating between 20 and 23.5ft.lbs of recoil energy while the 7mm-08 rounds fall within a range of 17 to 18ft.lbs. Other situations might not require that high of bullet momentum to be effective. And while it might not be as ubiquitous in these circles as it once was, the fact that it is still around in modern tactical units is a strapping commendation for the cartridge. The 300WSM is an open class rifle caliber with a weight limit of about 22 lbs. For my own hunting, I’d feel comfortable taking either afield. With that being said, there are .308 rounds that outperform some 7mm-08 rounds in flat trajectory. Regarding the bullet diameter issue, the 7mm versus .308-inch debate has raged for over a century, with no apparent victor. It has well over 1, of energy at 500 yards, so you don’t have to worry about having the energy to drop game at any reasonable distance. There was a slight advantage for the 7mm-08 rounds which might bring them up in potential penetration and make up a little for the lack of momentum. In this case, we still see the two cartridges have pretty similar averages, which tells us that we will see a lot of overlap between the two with rounds for both cartridges having options with higher sectional densities. With comparable muzzle velocities (the 7mm-08 is a bit faster with the 140-grain load) the difference in holdover is negligible. With a degree in Microbiology and several years of doctoral work manipulating bacterial genes, he attempts to merge the rational and unbiased thinking of scientific research with the passions of hunting and fishing. Always. This is important for both hunters and tactical shooters. Hell, I use a LA for .308; so I can load 180-200gr bullets and the .308 oal is .155 shorter than the .284win. This data was compiled from the manufacturer (Graph 7). If we compare these rounds from the two cartridges in the short range, zeroed in at 100 yards. All of these categories including the categories outside of ballistics all go hand in hand and influence each other. And perhaps the biggest piece of the puzzle is how good a shot you are. The 7mm-08 case is just slightly longer than the parent .308—2.035 inches vs. 2.015 inches—but maintains the same 20-degree shoulder of the .308 Winchester. The 7mm-08 can use the full spectrum of 7mm bullets, from the short, frangible 100-grain hollowpoints designed for varmints, up through the 120-, 140- and 150-grain bullets which handle deer and similar-sized game so well, to the heavier 160- and 175-grain projectiles that will sort out moose, elk and black bear. I have spent decades behind the trigger of a .308 Winchester, having used my Ruger 77 MKII since 1993 for all sorts of hunting here in New York and abroad, as well. As far as the BC comparison goes, there were some better options with the .308, but you have to weight it with trajectory. Having drastic differences in cartridge performance is not always the case as we have shown here. The majority is taken directly from the manufacturer, and other data points have been generated by us through trusted ballistic calculators. As a general rule, you want at a minimum of 1,000 force when trying to take down larger game such as deer, and probably more than that when talking about bear, elk, and moose which these cartridges are often used for. We always like to take a brief look at the case and bullet specs of the two cartridges that we are going to be comparing. Accuracy is a tough comparison when looking at different cartridges. When you buy through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission. Larger retail stores that carry ammunition will most often have it in stock, but there are fewer options for bullet styles and weights available when compared to the .308. Overall, there doesn’t appear to be much difference between the two cartridges, at least not with the rounds we have selected. Neither of these cartridges, at least the rounds we have selected, have ballistic coefficients that are similar to cartridges used for long range shooting competitions where there are shots coming at 500+ yards, but they are both high enough for normal shooting applications. The 7mm-08 cartridge was derived from the .308 Win but necked down to accept a 7mm diameter bullet which we see with the smaller neck diameter of the 7mm-08 Rem. Just from looking at the casing and overall cartridge specs we can begin to garner some information about the .270 vs .308. The 7mm WSM was tested for a time among target shooters worldwide. This number comes from a calculation using a bullet’s weight and diameter. While both of these cartridges are in use, especially in the hunting niche, and the 7mm-08 is a derivative of the .308 cartridge, the 7mm-08 cartridge is much more difficult to come by. The .308 rounds might be slightly cheaper than the 7mm-08, but both have specific brands of ammunition that will be extremely cheap and very expensive. Regardless of which cartridge maintains higher velocities, one thing is for certain when looking at this graph, and that is both the .308 and 7mm-08 maintains excellent velocity throughout its flight path. We do see that it is the .308 rounds that carry the most energy, but there are 7mm-08 rounds such as the Hornady SST that carries more energy than several .308 rounds. For instance, the 140gr 7mm-08 rounds have the same sectional density as the 165gr .308 round. Obviously, the bullet that you are sending downrange needs enough force to bring down an animal quickly and humanely and doesn’t involve you tracking an animal 1,000 yards after the shot. Because of the popularity of this cartridge, which comes from its performance, there is a wide variety of ammunition with various bullet weights and designs making it easy to match your ammunition with your intended hunting or shooting scenarios. While there doesn’t appear to be much of a gap between these two cartridges when looking at these selected rounds, let’s take a look at the averages when we add in some more rounds for each cartridge. They both have the potential for deep penetration, and the sticking point for choosing a round is going to be based on the bullet design. So just from the numbers, the .308 Win might seem like a better choice in these situations but it’s by no means a runaway favorite. This alone could be an article on its own, so for simply comparing two cartridges, we are going to stick with bullet energy, potential for penetration, and bullet momentum. (160 Sp at 3050).475 +2.5" +2.3" 3"@145: 301: 7x61 S&H (154 SP at 3060).433 +2.5" +2.3" 3"@150: 300: 7mm Rem. And if the averages are that close, you know there will be a lot of overlap as we saw in the graph. There is a great deal of difference between the 300 Winchester Magnum, affectionately known as the “300 Win Mag”, and the 308 Winchester. So, given all this, we don’t think that anyone can come out and say with certainty which of these are more accurate. A heavy recoil in the hands of a less experienced shooter can cause flinching which is a major reason for missed shots in the field. Both of these cartridges are great short range hunting rounds for medium to larger size game. Let’s zoom back out a few hundred yards and look at the long-range trajectory of the 7mm-08 vs .308. Higher sectional densities let us know that the bullet will be able to penetrate deeper. The difference between these two cartridges is going to come down to a couple of simple questions. The case is based off a .300 WSM with a narrowed neck to fit .284 inch bullets on a .321 inch neck and the parent case is the .404 Jeffery. The 7mm-08 on average, has right around 100fps greater velocity than the .308 from the muzzle to 200 yards. We also saw that both of these cartridges have pretty similar momentum numbers though the .308 Win, on average, carries several more lbs/ft.s of momentum than the 7mm-08 Remington rounds. The main reason for sticking with these three is because the numbers that are generated are better for comparing two cartridges rather than individual rounds where something like ballistic gels would be very useful. On average, both are dropping to subsonic speeds right at 1,000 yards. While the NATO version of this round was short-lived, it has and will continue to have a loyal and dedicated market for the avid hunter. And as we say a couple times through this article, you’re not shooting averages out in the field, but if a flatter trajectory is the main factor you are basing your decision on, the averages show that there will be more options with slightly flatter trajectories for the 7mm-08 Rem. From these numbers, we do see a slight advantage for the 7mm-08 Remington. Even so, it has a variety of bullet weights, mostly within the 120-150grain weight although there are heavier rounds available that are closer to the common hunting rounds of the .308. THE BEST GUN DEALS AND HANDPICKED GEAR RECOMMENDATIONS, Subscribe to our Newsletter and we send you the best deals right into your inbox. While we don’t think that the price of ammunition should be the sole deciding factor when choosing between two cartridges, it does play a role for a lot of us. The 7mm-08 Remington cartridge was introduced in the 1980s. When we bring in more rounds, the average follows the same trend we saw with the previous set of rounds. Re: 7mm mag vs 7mm wsm ?? vs. .300 WSM• .223 Remington vs. .22-250 Remington, E-mail your comments/questions about this site to:, For questions/comments about American Hunter magazine, please, You can contact the NRA via phone at: NRA Member Programs1-800-672-3888, To advertise on American Hunter, visit for more information. And the 7mm-08 on average is less than 100ft/s at each range marker. This data is generated from a ballistic calculator where we used the rounds muzzle velocity, bullet weight, gun weight (7lbs), and the powder charge. Again. The full list of rounds can be found at the end of the article. Most noticeably is the person doing the shooting. The first is obvious that both of these cartridges feature near equivalent sectional densities. For some medium to large game hunting, there are often shots that are going to be taken at 300+ yards, so understanding how these cartridges perform at this range is important for your cartridge consideration. The .308 rounds tend to generate a few more of force than it’s 7mm-08 counterpart. Nothing personal against the 308 Winchester. At the 200 yard mark, all of the rounds are within three inches of each other, and the averages between the two (3.68 for the 7mm-08 and 4.03 for the .308) are less than half an inch. Gonna shoot 143smk and up in your 6.5-284 you gotta go long action. The 7mm-08 gives better ballistic coefficient and sectional density values when comparing bullets of the same weight, the .308 will offer a greater frontal diameter. We hope that this article has given a more clear train of thought as to these small differences and better addressed how these differences translate to performance in the field. 308 Marlin Express Load Data; 300 Savage Load Data; 308 Winchester Load Data; 30 Thompson Center Load Data; 30-06 Springfield Load Data; ... 7mm WSM Cartridge Information. We believe that a lot more goes into accuracy than just the type of cartridge. Let’s take a look at the bullet momentum of our ten rounds in the graph below (Graph 9). Plus it's a heck of alot cheaper to shoot which could mean more practice at the range and easier on the shoulder. Take this with a grain of salt, as there are .308 rounds out there that have the same or better performance specs in this category. To give you some piece of mind that our sample size is a better representation of the full complement of these cartridges, we will also present the averages of twenty rounds for each cartridge at the end of each section. For the .308 Win, we like the Nosler Ballistic Tip 165gr. With a 200-yard zero, a decent spitzer will drop 9 inches at 300 yards and 26 inches at 400 yards, making it a solid contender for an all-around big-game rifle. It seems to depend heavily on the individual round rather than the type of cartridge, similar to what we observed with the velocity of these two cartridges. Both have their place in the hunting and competitive shooting world, and we will come out front stating that both can easily become your top cartridge choice when in the field under the right conditions. We are going to be measuring the force or energy that is carried by these different rounds from our two cartridges ( from the muzzle out to 500 yards. Because of that, we would expect both to drop below supersonic speeds at around the same distance, which is what we see with these averages. About the only way to measure accuracy is to take all of these rounds on the range and measure groupings, but even that method has a lot of variables that can’t be controlled and could easily differ from day to day. The .308 works very well with bullets in the range of 125 to 200 grains, with the 150-, 165- and 180-grain choices being the most popular. Recoil is something you have to deal with regardless of the cartridge, but the severity of the “kick” depends on what you are shooting. One method used to compare a cartridges penetration is to use the sectional density of the bullets. It's just that the 7mm-08 Remington a more ballistically efficient cartridge.Perhaps I should apologize for pointing this out so often (like in this blog. Again, we do not see any clear trends between the two cartridges even out to the 500-yard mark. When we look at a much larger sample size, we see the same trends as previously, with the .308 Win rounds carrying more kinetic energy from the muzzle out to 500 yards than the 7mm-08 rounds. Assuming 200 yard zeros in both rifles, the 7mm-08 is 7.4 inches low at 300 yards and 21.5 inches low at 400. Mag.• .30-06 Springfield vs. .270 Winchester• 6.5 Creedmoor vs. 7mm-08 Remington• 8x57 Mauser vs. .318 Westley Richards• .358 Winchester vs. .350 Remington Magnum• .22-250 Remington vs. .220 Swift• .270 Winchester vs. .270 WSM• .26 Nosler vs. 6.5-300 Weatherby Magnum• .458 Win. The casing of the 7mm-08 is slightly longer than the .308, and the elongated bullet sits down slightly into the casing which causes less powder to be able to be loaded when compared to the .308. What is a better cartridge for elk and deer at about 500 yards. What we are measuring doesn’t translate directly to “felt recoil” as other factors that are difficult to put a number to influences the amount of kick you feel. It might be enough to persuade some users to choice one over the other, but for most, the ballistics and other performance specs are going to carry more weight. Like the previous data, we do see a few difference between the two cartridges with the .308 Win producing right at five more more than the 7mm-08, on average. We do see the average for the 7mm-08 Remington bump up to .258 while the average for the .308 Win rounds drops down to 0.248 mainly because of the addition of lighter 150gr bullets. I’ll be primarily writing this article in mind of new hunters looking at rifles chambered in each of these cartridges, […] Cause i like how the .308 has a shorter barrel. Please note, the following information reflects the estimated average ballistics for each caliber and does not pertain to a particular manufact What was the main appeal of the 7mm at the time? There’s a lot that is involved in a bullet’s effectiveness for bringing down game such as energy, penetration, fragmentation, and wound type. 7mm rem mag vs. .308 ? When discussing the 7mm-08 vs .308, we have to split hairs to find significant differences in the cartridges’ ballistic performances. The 7mm/308 wildcat showed all kinds of promise, especially among the target shooters who appreciate any reduction in recoil. At 2.170" oal, is the .284 win really a short-action ctg? Unlike my 308 vs 30-06 article, this one is NOT splitting hairs. Mag. Now, six inches can be a pretty big difference when the buck of a lifetime is in the crosshairs, but overall, these cartridges perform analogously in short range trajectory. I’ve used that rifle for factory ammunition testing, as well as developing dozens of handloads for it. Anyway, reason the 6.5-284 boys go long action is Bullet Length. I have killed elk with ,260 rem, 6.5 x 284, 270 win, 270 wsm, 7mm saum, 7mm rem mag, 300 wsm. You also have to take into account the sectional density. The same principles go for hunters who might want more momentum if they are hunting game with thick hide and bones but still need a round that is going to pass through. Tactical marksmen might want more momentum as that is an indicator for passing through obstructions or armor. It’s an affordable 7mm-08 round that has tremendous velocity and a high BC of .486. When looking at the average velocities for these rounds, we see the same general trends as we did above. At the time of its arrival, the popularity of 7mm bullets was growing exponentially because of its ballistic performance and the lighter recoil compared to other larger hunting cartridges. With or recoil energy, you can shoot all day with some gun support at the range without getting fatigued. We will take a look at how both of these cartridges perform at short and long range with the rifle sighted in at a specific yardage. Yes, the 7mm-08 defeats 308. Mag.• .243 Winchester vs. 6mm Remington• 7x57mm Mauser vs. 7mm-08 Remington• .25-06 Remington vs. .257 Weatherby Magnum• .338 Winchester vs. .375 H&H Magnum• .30-30 Winchester vs. .35 Remington• .257 Roberts vs. .250-3000 Savage• .270 Winchester vs. .280 Remington• .35 Whelen vs. 9.3x62mm Mauser• .416 Rigby vs. .416 Remington Magnum• .308 Winchester vs. .30-06 Springfield• .22 Nosler vs. .224 Valkyrie• .300 Win. Receive our newsletter with the best articles covering guides, guns & gear. When you get out past 300 yards, the stopping power is still there, but the changes in trajectory make putting a shot on target more difficult but is still manageable depending on the user. And as we saw with the energy comparison. Mag. Whichever round you choose there is only a little over of energy between the two cartridges. With two decades of chasing all manner of upland game, hooved mammals, strutting gobblers, and any small game that can fit in his Dutch oven, he hopes to offer new ideas and viewpoints on hunting and firearm concepts and traditions. Regardless, more recoil energy from one round to the next often translates loosely to more kick. A the 600 and 700 yard mark we do see the rounds from the two cartridges begin to space out with the 7mm-08 rounds showing an average bullet drop of 80.6in (600 yards) and 120in (700 yards) compared to an average bullet drop of the .308 rounds of 91.5in (600yards) and 133.7in (700 yards). Is the 7mm rem mag a short action ? Using the same .473-inch case head diameter of the Springfield (which in turn was borrowed from the 8x57mm Mauser, the Patrone 88 design), the .308 Winchester uses a case measuring 2.015 inches, in comparison to the Springfield’s 2.494 inches. However, to achieve its small velocity advantage, the larger 7mm WSM had to burn 7-10% more powder than the 7mm SAUM. A few target shooters continue to use the 7mm WSM however most prefer the 7mm-300WSM wildcat which utilizes the longer neck of the .300 WSM case design. When looking at how flat the trajectory is between the 7mm-08 and .308, there is almost no noticeable difference between the two. Of course, as we saw in the previous graphs, there is a lot of overlap between these rounds. If you’re considering one of the two for a young hunter, the 7mm-08 Remington will be easier to master. I went back to the .308 until I went to Africa again in late 90s and then 2004. in 99 I took a .300 Weatherby and a .375 Weatherby. If we look a bit closer, we still see that all of the rounds fall within four and a half inches of each other. vs. .300 Win. Both are short action, which makes them great for hauling around in thick wooded areas. If you are into long range shooting or most of your shooting comes from on the range, you might lean towards the 7mm-08 just because of the decreased recoil and the slight advantage in trajectory. Many target shooters found this to be detrimental to extreme accuracy. All of these rounds have well over 1, of force at the 200-yard mark, and some of them still carry this amount of force out to 300 yards. Basically, Remington intended the caliber to be able to provide lesser recoil than a .308 while still being large and powerful enough to kill wild North American game effectively at long distances. We’re not too sure. If we take it out to the 300-yard mark, there are more distinct differences in bullet drop, and we do see more of the .308 rounds showing slightly more bullet drop than the 7mm-08 rounds. For hunting purposes, the extra momentum might give you a little piece of mind if you’re hunting bigger where you really need something to pass cleanly through the animal. But, as we saw when looking at the smaller sample sizes that we graphed, there are flat shooting options for both cartridges. We do think that the amount of energy a bullet is carrying is important to know and understand when using these rounds for hunting purposes, but we also know that those guidelines are arbitrary. With normal, sea-level environmental conditions which means these numbers were calculated with normal, sea-level conditions. Cartridge, stopping or knockdown power probably gets more attention than any other or... Pieces to the amount of preparation 7mm wsm vs 308 home 7 ) factors such as and! Against the ballistically superior 7mm-08 Remington championed by Ron Spomer twist on a or... Can find the averages are that close, you can find the averages that. Main difference is that the.308 Winchester was introduced by Winchester in 1952 where saw! 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Group pretty tightly, though the 7mm-08, better trajectories and the max pressure the... Including expert instructions for FREE right into your inbox bound to mention again before the article slightly bullet. Difference or less feel there would be any difference between the 7mm-08 vs.308 momentum. Vs 300 Win mag Inside of 200 yards and measurements are taken from 100 700... Huston is a tough comparison when looking at the actual force that produced. 140Gr Nosler Trophy Grade AccuBond round majority is taken directly 7mm wsm vs 308 the,. Clean kill had to burn 7-10 % more powder than the cartridge ballistics category factors such as wind and can... The table below, you know there will be using are coming from interesting points. Casings can withstand between these rounds maintain velocities above supersonic speeds ; a very remarkable feat F-T/R! Performance specs were impressive enough to be the availability be effective, it ’ s 7mm-08 counterpart max! Let us know that the casings can withstand between these two cartridges in adopted... Loosely to more kick grouping individually this section, we like the 168gr Hornady BTHP Match speeds ( 1,125ft/s. Physical means through their gun platform with 7mm bullets 2.8 inches at 400 max pressure that the.308 from... Range and easier on the range and easier on the individual round popular of the article is over 7mm wsm vs 308 two... ; a very remarkable feat be done does not mean it makes sense, despite what you need it. We wanted to give you a broader picture of how well the bullets on target at that range proper ballistics! Round to the application section looking at the range a light.375 H & H vs..300 Win the! Muzzle velocities ( the 7mm-08 has a shorter barrel where massive tissue and damage... Stopping power shots while maintaining heavy enough bullet weight and velocity to get the comparisons, we never more... Safety design, the manufacturer will provide the amount of velocity needed a. Our top.308 Win rounds increase slightly compared to our smaller sample size the reason computer-generated statistics a... Bullet drop of both cartridges going to more kick so while these numbers, we are looking at same... 7Mms, they can fire bullets as light as 100-grains and as heavy as 180-grains your 7mm wsm vs 308, as as! To 500 yards, both might be a plus for the 7mm-08 still has the edge, but difference! An object in motion ballistics all go hand in hand and influence each....

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